uzi § 5 paces?

Ron Stark [ronstark§snapsite.com.au] wrote:
> Too far - they might miss each other :) 
> 
> :  -----Original Message-----
> :  From: Deus Ex Machina [mailto:vicc§cia.com.au] 
> :  Sent: Thursday, 24 March 2005 1:48 PM
> :  To: dns§dotau.org
> :  Subject: Re: [DNS] List rules
> :  
> :  pistols § 20 paces?
> :  
> :  
> :  Adam Matthews [adam§echo-host.net] wrote:
> :  > You have absolutely no idea, just faaaaaaaarrk off.
> :  > 
> :  > -----Original Message-----
> :  > From: info§australianwebsites.com 
> :  [mailto:info§australianwebsites.com]
> :  > Sent: Thursday, 24 March 2005 1:27 PM
> :  > To: dns§dotau.org
> :  > Subject: Re: [DNS] List rules
> :  > 
> :  > Larry,
> :  > 
> :  > I agree with everyone who thought the issue of the allegations 
> :  > initiated by Adam against Planet Domain, in reply to Jim's 
> :  original 
> :  > post seeking help on a domain issue took too long to resolve.
> :  > 
> :  > ( Due in part originally to the number of posts it took Adam to 
> :  > provide more specific information to support his allegations when 
> :  > invited to do so. )
> :  > 
> :  > Let us remember that it was Adam, not I, who, at the mere 
> :  mention of 
> :  > the 2 words
> :  > 
> :  > "Planet Domain"
> :  > 
> :  > in Jim's long email seeking help, chose to make the very 
> :  first post as 
> :  > a reply to Jim's request for help.
> :  > 
> :  > Did Adam's reply to Jim's post offer any help? No, it didn't.
> :  > 
> :  > It was criticisms / allegations directed specifically at Planet 
> :  > Domain, "their technical support team" and Adam even went on to 
> :  > criticise Murray Kester, the Manager of Planet Domain, 
> :  personally by name!
> :  > 
> :  > It was at this point that a new issue was raised.
> :  > 
> :  > Making criticisms / allegations against a Registrar is a serious 
> :  > matter and is messing with the livelihoods of all the 
> :  people who work 
> :  > there and the people who are Resellers for Planet Domain also.
> :  > 
> :  > Looking back now its a little sad that, overall, more time 
> :  was spent 
> :  > by some people on debating procedural type issues like 
> :  relevancy to a 
> :  > thread, than whether it was fair or just, to publicly criticise a 
> :  > Registrar, "their technical support team"
> :  > and Murray Kester,
> :  > the Manager of Planet Domain, and even arguing whether or not 
> :  > allegations like that should go unquestioned, and you Larry, by 
> :  > saying, and I quote,
> :  > 
> :  > "Adam - he simply recounted his experience"
> :  > 
> :  > implied those allegations were true.
> :  > 
> :  > That serious allegations can be made which then start 
> :  being referred 
> :  > to as though they were true, is a recipe for a truly 
> :  unfair DNS list, 
> :  > were this list to be moderated to stifle 2 sided debate.
> :  > 
> :  > As Trent pointed out
> :  > 
> :  > "The 'other thread' is history and it was self moderated 
> :  to a degree.
> :  > In so doing, if just one person took some form of 
> :  education away from 
> :  > it, then although annoying, it served its purpose."
> :  > 
> :  > Proposals of moderation need to be very carefully thought about as 
> :  > moderation can easily become censorship in practice.
> :  > 
> :  > I submit that 2 sided debate is always preferable to 1 
> :  sided negative 
> :  > allegations - where the person making those allegations goes 
> :  > unquestioned and / or unchallenged and supporting facts sought.
> :  > 
> :  > A useful guideline for this list would be that if anyone 
> :  is going to 
> :  > make a criticism of any person or company at anytime in 
> :  the future it 
> :  > should be based on facts only, and they should be prepared 
> :  to present 
> :  > those specific facts, or for example a link to a news article, to 
> :  > support their criticisms, and present them in a timely 
> :  manner, so that 
> :  > debates are efficient, productive, and provide useful information.
> :  > 
> :  > If any moderation included banning all non .au domain issues even 
> :  > Jim's original request for help would have been culled out as it 
> :  > regarded a .com domain only.
> :  > 
> :  > As there is not a TLD list where people such as Jim can 
> :  seek help and 
> :  > anyone can discuss TLD specific issues, perhaps a separate 
> :  TLD list 
> :  > could be started.
> :  > 
> :  > 
> :  > Regards
> :  > Barry Armstrong
> :  > 
> :  > 
> :  > 
> :  > 
> :  > 
> :  > 
> :  > 
> :  > 
> :  > 
> :  > 
> :  >   ----- Original Message ----- 
> :  >   From: Larry Bloch 
> :  >   To: dns§dotau.org 
> :  >   Sent: Tuesday, March 22, 2005 12:03 PM
> :  >   Subject: RE: [DNS] List rules
> :  > 
> :  > 
> :  >   Trent,
> :  > 
> :  >   Moderating a list is a thankless task - definitely.
> :  > 
> :  >   I'm not so sure that "no news is good news" in this 
> :  list's case. I 
> :  > think its
> :  >   probably fairer to say no news is an indication that the 
> :  real issues 
> :  > are not
> :  >   being raised in this forum, and that is a pity. Why are 
> :  the issues 
> :  > not being
> :  >   discussed here? Because the list lacks credibility as a 
> :  place where useful
> :  >   debate happens, and that?s an historical fact.
> :  > 
> :  >   This list has been over used for outbursts (as we have 
> :  seen yesterday),
> :  >   vitriolic personal attacks, loony conspiracy theorists, 
> :  hatchet jobs 
> :  > and the
> :  >   like. You only have to go back and see Chris Disspain's written 
> :  > comments on
> :  >   his attitude to posting to this list to see a reflection 
> :  of that reality.
> :  >   His frustration with the manner and tone of postings is 
> :  shared by many of
> :  >   the professionals in this industry who as a result lurk 
> :  but steer clear of
> :  >   posting.
> :  > 
> :  >   If all of us subscribed want to get something more that 
> :  the odd bit 
> :  > of news
> :  >   out of the list, then as a community we need to have 
> :  some sort of 
> :  > acceptable
> :  >   use standards - formal or otherwise. And I take your 
> :  point that the recent
> :  >   episode did resolve in a 'natural order' way. Its just a little 
> :  > inefficient
> :  >   sometimes.
> :  > 
> :  >   Larry
> :  > 
> :  > 
> :  > 
> :  >   > -----Original Message-----
> :  >   > From: trent§sos.net.au [mailto:trent§sos.net.au] 
> :  >   > Sent: Tuesday, 22 March 2005 11:46
> :  >   > To: dns§dotau.org
> :  >   > Subject: Re: [DNS] List rules
> :  >   > 
> :  >   > 
> :  >   > Larry,
> :  >   > In theory, this would be great, but Kim, at least I assume it 
> :  >   > was Kim, 
> :  >   > has outlined in the first line of the policy that this list 
> :  >   > is unmoderated.
> :  >   > 
> :  >   > Like your own post, my point is subjective. The 'other 
> :  thread' is 
> :  >   > history and it was self moderated to a degree. In so doing, 
> :  >   > if just one 
> :  >   > person took some form of education away from it, then 
> :  >   > although annoying, 
> :  >   > it served its purpose. That might mean fewer of these 
> :  outbursts and I 
> :  >   > know that's hoping for allot, but I'm a hopeful kind of guy ;)
> :  >   > 
> :  >   > If Kim wishes to moderate, that's his decision as list 
> :  >   > manager, but it 
> :  >   > is a time issue, so I for one would understand if he chooses 
> :  >   > not to. In the mean time, the list, as Sean pointed out, 
> :  >   > generally moves along 
> :  >   > at a dead crawl. This is indicative of the "no news is 
> :  good news" 
> :  >   > clich?, and we can, as Vic pointed out, use the good 
> :  ol' D key when 
> :  >   > someone won't leave well enough alone.
> :  >   > 
> :  >   > Having said all that, and provided you have the time 
> :  Larry, perhaps a 
> :  >   > related list is something you feel would be in order? 
> :  'Any' list 
> :  >   > generates information we can potentially learn from, 
> :  and I would 
> :  >   > definitely have a look at the focus of any new list that 
> :  >   > might assist me 
> :  >   > in advising clients and colleagues.
> :  >   > 
> :  >   > Cheers,
> :  > 
> :  > 
> :  > 
> :  > 
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